Gary Marcus

Rank 13 of 47
|
Score 83
4/29/2025, 2:43:15 PM
X
In reply to:
Dylan HadfieldMenell
@dhadfieldmenell
·
258d
@GaryMarcus @tyler_m_john You’re confusing the difficulty of incentive specification with details of LLM and current methods.

I don’t expect it to emerge from LLMs magically but the same limits will apply to neurosymbolic methods as long as they can be well modeled as optimizing an incomplete objective.
Gary Marcus
@GaryMarcus
·
258d
@dhadfieldmenell @tyler_m_john Almost the entire field has myopically focused on a single approach that is doomed in my view.

Normative social order is very complex. But expecting it emerge from a fine-tuned LLM and a big corpus is foolish.
Dylan HadfieldMenell
@dhadfieldmenell
·
258d
@GaryMarcus @tyler_m_john I think it would be helpful to ask yourself why a bunch of smart/motivated people haven’t just done this. It’s not because we’re idiots.

Your comment is far too optimistic about the complexity of normative social order and how it operates in humans.
Gary Marcus
@GaryMarcus
·
258d
@tyler_m_john it’s more than a trillion actions but its not a trillion norms. maybe it’s only 100 and we should hand-write some of them, rather than leaving everything entirely to the chance vicissitudes of what is in some training corpus.
Tyler John
@tyler_m_john
·
259d
@GaryMarcus Every decision or speech act bakes in a billion complex, subtle values, about efficiency, honesty, empathy, respect, social norms, empiricism, aesthetics, deference, humility, and on and on. How would you write a set of goals that leads to good norms across a trillion actions?
Gary Marcus
@GaryMarcus
·
259d
@tyler_m_john Why are the values so complicated?

Can’t be hand coded in a LLM but that’s an a LLM issue, not inherent to AI.

The statement is part of a complex discussion on the capabilities and limitations of AI systems, particularly in relation to ethics and normative social order. It engages with public issues concerning AI development and ethical considerations, making it a part of public discourse.

  1. Principle 1:
    I will strive to do no harm with my words and actions.
    The statement does not cause harm and is focused on a technical discussion, adhering to the principle. [+1]
  2. Principle 3:
    I will use my words and actions to promote understanding, empathy, and compassion.
    The statement aims to promote understanding of AI systems and their limitations, aligning with the principle. [+1]
  3. Principle 4:
    I will engage in constructive criticism and dialogue with those in disagreement and will not engage in personal attacks or ad hominem arguments.
    The statement engages in constructive dialogue without personal attacks, adhering to the principle. [+1]
  4. Principle 7:
    I will uphold the principles of free speech and use my platform responsibly and with integrity.
    The statement contributes to a public discussion on AI ethics, using the platform responsibly. [+1]